Hilchot Tefilla - Arve Pesachim (II)

What should the Seder of Pesach be about, now that the Temple is destroyed?

ד מָזְגוּ לוֹ כוֹס שֵׁנִי, וְכֵן הַבֵּן שׁוֹאֵל. אִם אֵין דַּעַת בַּבֵּן, אָבִיו מְלַמְּדוֹ: "מַה נִּשְׁתַּנָּה הַלַּיְלָה הַזֶּה מִכָּל הַלֵּילוֹת? שֶׁבְּכָל הַלֵּילוֹת אֵין אָנוּ מְטַבְּלִים אֲפִלּוּ פַעַם אַחַת, הַלַּיְלָה הַזֶּה שְׁתֵּי פְעָמִים; שֶׁבְּכָל הַלֵּילוֹת אָנוּ אוֹכְלִין חָמֵץ וּמַצָּה, הַלַּיְלָה הַזֶּה כֻלּוֹ מַצָּה; שֶׁבְּכָל הַלֵּילוֹת אָנוּ אוֹכְלִים בָּשָׂר צָלִי שָׁלוּק וּמְבֻשָּׁל, הַלַּיְלָה הַזֶּה כֻלּוֹ צָלִי." לְפִי דַעְתּוֹ שֶׁלַּבֵּן אָבִיו מְלַמְּדוֹ. מַתְחִיל בִּגְנוּת וּמְסַיֵּם בִּשְׁבָח, וְדוֹרֵשׁ מֵ "אֲרַמִּי אֹבֵד אָבִי" (דברים כו,ה), עַד שֶׁהוּא גוֹמֵר כָּל הַפָּרָשָׁה.

Mishnah Pesachim 10:4

The attendants poured the second cup for the leader of the seder, and here the son asks his father the questions about the differences between Passover night and a regular night. And if the son does not have the intelligence to ask questions on his own, his father teaches him the questions. The mishna lists the questions: Why is this night different from all other nights? As on all other nights we eat leavened bread and matza as preferred; on this night all our bread is matza. As on all other nights we eat other vegetables; on this night we eat bitter herbs. The mishna continues its list of the questions. When the Temple was standing one would ask: As on all other nights we eat either roasted, stewed, or cooked meat, but on this night all the meat is the roasted meat of the Paschal lamb. The final question was asked even after the destruction of the Temple: As on all other nights we dip the vegetables in a liquid during the meal only once; however, on this night we dip twice. And according to the intelligence and the ability of the son, his father teaches him about the Exodus. When teaching his son about the Exodus. He begins with the Jewish people’s disgrace and concludes with their glory. And he expounds from the passage: “An Aramean tried to destroy my father” (Deuteronomy 26:5), the declaration one recites when presenting his first fruits at the Temple, until he concludes explaining the entire section.

משנה פסחים י׳:ה׳

ה רַבָּן גַּמְלִיאֵל אוֹמֵר: כָּל שֶׁלֹּא אָמַר שְׁלוֹשָׁה דְבָרִים אֵלּוּ בַפֶּסַח, לֹא יָצָא יְדֵי חוֹבָתוֹ: "פֶּסַח, מַצָּה וּמְרוֹרִים. פֶּסַח, עַל שֵׁם שֶׁפָּסַח הַמָּקוֹם עַל בָּתֵּי אֲבוֹתֵינוּ בְמִצְרַיִם. מְרוֹרִים, עַל שֵׁם שֶׁמֵּרְרוּ הַמִּצְרִיִּים אֶת חַיֵּי אֲבוֹתֵינוּ בְמִצְרַיִם. מַצָּה, עַל שֵׁם שֶׁנִּגְאָלוּ. לְפִיכָךְ אָנוּ חַיָּבִים לְהוֹדוֹת, לְהַלֵּל, לְשַׁבֵּח, לְפָאֵר, לְרוֹמֵם, לְגַדֵּל לְמִי שֶׁעָשָׂה לָנוּ וְלַאֲבוֹתֵינוּ אֶת כָּל הַנִּסִּים הָאֵלּוּ, וְהוֹצִיאָנוּ מֵעַבְדוּת לְחֵרוּת, וְנֹאמַר לְפָנָיו הַלְלוּיָהּ."

Mishnah Pesachim 10:5

Rabban Gamliel would say: Anyone who did not say these three matters on Passover has not fulfilled his obligation: The Paschal lamb, matza, and bitter herbs. When one mentions these matters, he must elaborate and explain them: The Paschal lamb is brought because the Omnipresent passed over [pasaḥ] the houses of our forefathers in Egypt, as it is stated: “That you shall say: It is the sacrifice of the Lord’s Paschal offering for He passed over the houses of the children of Israel in Egypt, when he smote the Egyptians, and delivered our houses” (Exodus 12:27). Rabban Gamliel continues to explain: The reason for matza is because our forefathers were redeemed from Egypt, as it is stated: “And they baked the dough that they took out of Egypt as cakes of matzot, for it was not leavened, as they were thrust out of Egypt and could not tarry, neither had they prepared for themselves any victual” (Exodus 12:39). The reason for bitter herbs is because the Egyptians embittered our forefathers’ lives in Egypt, as it is stated: “And they embittered their lives with hard service, in mortar and in brick; in all manner of service in the field, all the service that they made them serve was with rigor” (Exodus 1:14). The tanna of the mishna further states: In each and every generation a person must view himself as though he personally left Egypt, as it is stated: “And you shall tell your son on that day, saying: It is because of this which the Lord did for me when I came forth out of Egypt” (Exodus 13:8). In every generation, each person must say: “This which the Lord did for me,” and not: This which the Lord did for my forefathers. The mishna continues with the text of the Haggadah. Therefore we are obligated to thank, praise, glorify, extol, exalt, honor, bless, revere, and laud [lekales] the One who performed for our forefathers and for us all these miracles: He took us out from slavery to freedom, from sorrow to joy, from mourning to a Festival, from darkness to a great light, and from enslavement to redemption. And we will say before Him: Halleluya. At this point one recites the hallel that is said on all joyous days. Since one does not complete hallel at this point in the seder, the mishna asks:

משנה פסחים ד׳:ד׳

מָקוֹם שֶׁנָּהֲגוּ לֶאֱכֹל צָלִי בְלֵילֵי פְסָחִים, אוֹכְלִין. מָקוֹם שֶׁנָּהֲגוּ שֶׁלֹּא לֶאֱכֹל, אֵין אוֹכְלִין

Mishnah Pesachim 4:4

The mishna cites another custom related to Passover. In a place where people were accustomed to eat roasted meat on Passover evenings, outside of Jerusalem or after the Temple was destroyed, one may eat it. In a place where people were accustomed not to eat outside Jerusalem, one may not eat it. The mishna discusses additional differences between local customs. In a place where people were accustomed to kindle a lamp in the house on Yom Kippur evenings, one kindles it. In a place where people were accustomed not to kindle a lamp, one does not kindle it. However, even in a place where the custom is not to kindle lamps in houses, one kindles in synagogues and study halls, in deference to these places. Similarly, lamps should be kindled in dark alleyways, so people will not be hurt, and next to the sick.

משנה ביצה ב׳:ז׳

אַף הוּא (רבן גמליאל) אָמַר שְׁלֹשָׁה דְבָרִים לְהָקֵל… וְעוֹשִׂין גְּדִי מְקֻלָּס בְּלֵילֵי פְסָחִים. וַחֲכָמִים אוֹסְרִין:

Mishnah Beitzah 2:7

Rabban Gamliel also said three things as leniencies, in opposition to the view of most of the Sages: One may sweep the room of the couches on a Festival, i.e., the dining room, where they would recline on couches to eat, as there is no concern that by sweeping the room one might come to fill in the holes and level the ground. And one may place incense consisting of fragrant herbs on burning coals in order to perfume one’s house on a Festival. And one may prepare a whole kid goat, meaning a kid goat roasted whole, with its entrails over its head, on the night of Passover, as was the custom when they roasted the Paschal lamb in the Temple. However, the Rabbis prohibit all three practices: It is prohibited to sweep lest one come to level the ground, it is prohibited to burn incense because it does not meet the criteria of permitted food preparation, and it is prohibited to eat a kid that was roasted whole on the night of Passover because it would appear as if he were eating consecrated food outside the Temple.

The Mishnah here innovates the concept that Seder night is about telling a story about the Exodus, rather than having a meal centered around the Korban Pesach followed by the study its laws; the symbols of Pesach, Matza and Merrorim have become prompts for telling this story. It is interesting that Ma Nishtana originally had only three sections, parallelling the three symbols of Pesach, Matza and Merrorim required by the next mishna. Note that Rabban Gamliel was the leader of the Sanhedrin at Yavne, after the destruction of the Second Temple. Also note that Ma Nishtana does not contain questions that the child should ask, but rather instructions that the father should give to the child who cannot (yet) ask himself following the requirements of Rabban Gamliel. Finally note that it was specifically Rabban Gamliel who insisted to have roasted meet at the Seder, even after the destruction of the Second Temple in commemoration of the Korban Pesach, while the Chachamim were not in favor of this. Still we see that this was the minhag in certain places and that this is reflected in the text of Ma Nishtana.

תלמוד ירושלמי פסחים י׳:ה׳:ב׳

הלכה: רַב אָמַר. מִתְּחִילָּה. צָרִיךְ לְהַתְחִיל בְּעֵ֣בֶר הַנָּהָ֗ר יָֽשְׁב֤וּ אֲבֽוֹתֵיכֶם֙ וגו׳. וָֽ֠אֶקַּח֠ אֶת־אֲבִיכֶ֤ם אֶת־אַבְרָהָם֙ מֵעֵ֣בֶר הַנָּהָ֔ר וגו׳.

Jerusalem Talmud Pesachim 10:5:2

HALAKHAH: Rav said, a priori he has to start with your forefathers always lived on the far side of the River, etc. But I took your father Abraham from the far side of the River, etc And I increased. Rebbi Aḥa said, the ketib is וארב. How may quarrels I made for him before I gave him Isaac. Another explanation, I prepared an ambush for him. If he would sin, to repay him, if he would acquire merit, to reward him.

פסחים קט״ז א:י״א

מַתְחִיל בִּגְנוּת וּמְסַיֵּים בְּשֶׁבַח. מַאי בִּגְנוּת? רַב אָמַר: ״מִתְּחִלָּה עוֹבְדֵי עֲבוֹדָה זָרָה הָיוּ אֲבוֹתֵינוּ״. [וּשְׁמוּאֵל] אָמַר: ״עֲבָדִים הָיִינוּ״.

Pesachim 116a:11

It was taught in the mishna that the father begins his answer with disgrace and concludes with glory. The Gemara asks: What is the meaning of the term: With disgrace? Rav said that one should begin by saying: At first our forefathers were idol worshippers, before concluding with words of glory. And Shmuel said: The disgrace with which one should begin his answer is: We were slaves.

What is the Genut (disgrace) according to the Yerushalmi, and what is it according to the Bavli? Note that the Bavli cites the statement of Rav, originating in the Yerushalmi, in a very different way than it appeared in the Yerushalmi. What could be the reason for this? What is the source of the statement "Avadim Hayinu"? And is it true that we complete the parasha of "Arami Oveed Avi" till its end?

דברים כ״ו:ה׳-ט׳

(ה) וְעָנִ֨יתָ וְאָמַרְתָּ֜ לִפְנֵ֣י ׀ ה' אֱלֹקֶ֗יךָ אֲרַמִּי֙ אֹבֵ֣ד אָבִ֔י וַיֵּ֣רֶד מִצְרַ֔יְמָה וַיָּ֥גׇר שָׁ֖ם בִּמְתֵ֣י מְעָ֑ט וַֽיְהִי־שָׁ֕ם לְג֥וֹי גָּד֖וֹל עָצ֥וּם וָרָֽב׃ (ו) וַיָּרֵ֧עוּ אֹתָ֛נוּ הַמִּצְרִ֖ים וַיְעַנּ֑וּנוּ וַיִּתְּנ֥וּ עָלֵ֖ינוּ עֲבֹדָ֥ה קָשָֽׁה׃ (ז) וַנִּצְעַ֕ק אֶל־ה' אֱלֹקֵ֣י אֲבֹתֵ֑ינוּ וַיִּשְׁמַ֤ע ה' אֶת־קֹלֵ֔נוּ וַיַּ֧רְא אֶת־עׇנְיֵ֛נוּ וְאֶת־עֲמָלֵ֖נוּ וְאֶֽת־לַחֲצֵֽנוּ׃ (ח) וַיּוֹצִאֵ֤נוּ ה' מִמִּצְרַ֔יִם בְּיָ֤ד חֲזָקָה֙ וּבִזְרֹ֣עַ נְטוּיָ֔ה וּבְמֹרָ֖א גָּדֹ֑ל וּבְאֹת֖וֹת וּבְמֹפְתִֽים׃ (ט) וַיְבִאֵ֖נוּ אֶל־הַמָּק֣וֹם הַזֶּ֑ה וַיִּתֶּן־לָ֙נוּ֙ אֶת־הָאָ֣רֶץ הַזֹּ֔את אֶ֛רֶץ זָבַ֥ת חָלָ֖ב וּדְבָֽשׁ׃

Deuteronomy 26:5-9

(5) You*you See note at 12.7. shall then recite as follows before your God ה': “My father was a fugitive Aramean. He went down to Egypt with meager numbers and sojourned there; but there he became a great and very populous nation. (6) The Egyptians dealt harshly with us and oppressed us; they imposed heavy labor upon us. (7) We cried to ה', the God of our ancestors, and ה' heard our plea and saw our plight, our misery, and our oppression. (8) ה' freed us from Egypt by a mighty hand, by an outstretched arm and awesome power, and by signs and portents, (9) bringing us to this place and giving us this land, a land flowing with milk and honey.

JTS Ms. 9560 contains the Erets Yisrael version of the Haggadah from the 11th century. In line with the Talmud Yerushalmi, Ma Nishtana ends with the section on roasted meat; it is immediately followed by the section of בְּעֵ֣בֶר הַנָּהָ֗ר, it does not contain the section עֲבָדִים הָיִינוּ, nor the stories about the sages in Bne Brak and about R Elazar b Azarya, nor the section on the Four Children. The Babylonian Haggadah added these colorful stories to reinforce the message at the end of the Avadim Hayinu section “וְכָל הַמַּרְבֶּה לְסַפֵּר בִּיצִיאַת מִצְרַיִם הֲרֵי זֶה מְשֻׁבָּח”. Similarly, it added the midrash on the Four Children, as Avadim Hayinu is taken from the very same biblical verses from which the question of the Chacham was taken. As the Erets Yisrael version does not contain Avadim Hayinu, it also does not contain these other additional sections.

The section of the Four Children amd its sources

הגדה של פסח, מגיד, כנגד ארבעה בנים ב׳-ה׳

חָכָם מָה הוּא אוֹמֵר? מָה הָעֵדוֹת וְהַחֻקִּים וְהַמִּשְׁפָּטִים אֲשֶׁר צִוָּה ה' אֱלֹקֵינוּ אֶתְכֶם. וְאַף אַתָּה אֱמוֹר לוֹ כְּהִלְכוֹת הַפֶּסַח: אֵין מַפְטִירִין אַחַר הַפֶּסַח אֲפִיקוֹמָן:

רָשָׁע מָה הוּא אוֹמֵר? מָה הָעֲבוֹדָה הַזּאֹת לָכֶם. לָכֶם – וְלֹא לוֹ. וּלְפִי שֶׁהוֹצִיא אֶת עַצְמוֹ מִן הַכְּלָל כָּפַר בְּעִקָּר. וְאַף אַתָּה הַקְהֵה אֶת שִׁנָּיו וֶאֱמוֹר לוֹ: "בַּעֲבוּר זֶה עָשָׂה ה' לִי בְּצֵאתִי מִמִּצְרָיִם". לִי וְלֹא־לוֹ. אִלּוּ הָיָה שָׁם, לֹא הָיָה נִגְאָל:

תָּם מָה הוּא אוֹמֵר? מַה זּאֹת? וְאָמַרְתָּ אֵלָיו "בְּחוֹזֶק יָד הוֹצִיאָנוּ ה' מִמִּצְרַיִם מִבֵּית עֲבָדִים".

וְשֶׁאֵינוֹ יוֹדֵעַ לִשְׁאוֹל – אַתְּ פְּתַח לוֹ, שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר, וְהִגַּדְתָּ לְבִנְךָ בַּיּוֹם הַהוּא לֵאמֹר, בַּעֲבוּר זֶה עָשָׂה ה' לִי בְּצֵאתִי מִמִּצְרָיִם.

Pesach Haggadah, Magid, The Four Sons 2-5

What does the wise [son] say? "'What are these testimonies, statutes and judgments that the Lord our God commanded you?' (Deuteronomy 6:20)" And accordingly you will say to him, as per the laws of the Pesach sacrifice, "We may not eat an afikoman [a dessert or other foods eaten after the meal] after [we are finished eating] the Pesach sacrifice (Mishnah Pesachim 10:8)."

What does the evil [son] say? "'What is this worship to you?' (Exodus 12:26)" 'To you' and not 'to him.' And since he excluded himself from the collective, he denied a principle [of the Jewish faith]. And accordingly, you will blunt his teeth and say to him, "'For the sake of this, did the Lord do [this] for me in my going out of Egypt' (Exodus 13:8)." 'For me' and not 'for him.' If he had been there, he would not have been saved.

What does the innocent [son] say? "'What is this?' (Exodus 13:14)" And you will say to him, "'With the strength of [His] hand did the Lord take us out from Egypt, from the house of slaves' (Exodus 13:14).'"

And [regarding] the one who doesn't know to ask, you will open [the conversation] for him. As it is stated (Exodus 13:8), "And you will speak to your son on that day saying, for the sake of this, did the Lord do [this] for me in my going out of Egypt."

Parashat Va'etchanan

דברים ו׳:כ׳-כ״ג

(כ) כִּֽי־יִשְׁאָלְךָ֥ בִנְךָ֛ מָחָ֖ר לֵאמֹ֑ר מָ֣ה הָעֵדֹ֗ת וְהַֽחֻקִּים֙ וְהַמִּשְׁפָּטִ֔ים אֲשֶׁ֥ר צִוָּ֛ה ה' אֱלֹקֵ֖ינוּ אֶתְכֶֽם׃ (כא) וְאָמַרְתָּ֣ לְבִנְךָ֔ עֲבָדִ֛ים הָיִ֥ינוּ לְפַרְעֹ֖ה בְּמִצְרָ֑יִם וַיֹּצִיאֵ֧נוּ ה' מִמִּצְרַ֖יִם בְּיָ֥ד חֲזָקָֽה׃ (כב) וַיִּתֵּ֣ן ה' אוֹתֹ֣ת וּ֠מֹפְתִ֠ים גְּדֹלִ֨ים וְרָעִ֧ים ׀ בְּמִצְרַ֛יִם בְּפַרְעֹ֥ה וּבְכׇל־בֵּית֖וֹ לְעֵינֵֽינוּ׃ (כג) וְאוֹתָ֖נוּ הוֹצִ֣יא מִשָּׁ֑ם לְמַ֙עַן֙ הָבִ֣יא אֹתָ֔נוּ לָ֤תֶת לָ֙נוּ֙ אֶת־הָאָ֔רֶץ אֲשֶׁ֥ר נִשְׁבַּ֖ע לַאֲבֹתֵֽינוּ׃

Deuteronomy 6:20-23

(20) When, in time to come, your children ask you, “What mean the decrees, laws, and rules that our God ה' has enjoined upon you?”*you Septuagint and rabbinic quotations read “us.” (21) you shall say to your children, “We were slaves to Pharaoh in Egypt and ה' freed us from Egypt with a mighty hand. (22) ה' wrought before our eyes marvelous and destructive signs and portents in Egypt, against Pharaoh and all his household; (23) and us [God] freed from there, in order to take us and give us the land promised on oath to our fathers.

Parashat Bo

שמות י״ב:כ״ו-כ״ז

(כו) וְהָיָ֕ה כִּֽי־יֹאמְר֥וּ אֲלֵיכֶ֖ם בְּנֵיכֶ֑ם מָ֛ה הָעֲבֹדָ֥ה הַזֹּ֖את לָכֶֽם׃ (כז) וַאֲמַרְתֶּ֡ם זֶֽבַח־פֶּ֨סַח ה֜וּא לַֽה' אֲשֶׁ֣ר פָּ֠סַ֠ח עַל־בָּתֵּ֤י בְנֵֽי־יִשְׂרָאֵל֙ בְּמִצְרַ֔יִם בְּנׇגְפּ֥וֹ אֶת־מִצְרַ֖יִם וְאֶת־בָּתֵּ֣ינוּ הִצִּ֑יל וַיִּקֹּ֥ד הָעָ֖ם וַיִּֽשְׁתַּחֲוֽוּ׃

Exodus 12:26-27

(26) And when your children ask you, ‘What do you mean by this rite?’ (27) you shall say, ‘It is the passover sacrifice to ה', who passed over the houses of the Israelites in Egypt when smiting the Egyptians, but saved our houses.’ Those assembled then bowed low in homage.

שמות י״ג:ח׳

(ח) וְהִגַּדְתָּ֣ לְבִנְךָ֔ בַּיּ֥וֹם הַה֖וּא לֵאמֹ֑ר בַּעֲב֣וּר זֶ֗ה עָשָׂ֤ה ה' לִ֔י בְּצֵאתִ֖י מִמִּצְרָֽיִם׃

Exodus 13:8

(8) And you shall explain to your child on that day, ‘It is because of what ה' did for me when I went free from Egypt.’

שמות י״ג:י״ד-ט״ו

(יד) וְהָיָ֞ה כִּֽי־יִשְׁאָלְךָ֥ בִנְךָ֛ מָחָ֖ר לֵאמֹ֣ר מַה־זֹּ֑את וְאָמַרְתָּ֣ אֵלָ֔יו בְּחֹ֣זֶק יָ֗ד הוֹצִיאָ֧נוּ ה' מִמִּצְרַ֖יִם מִבֵּ֥ית עֲבָדִֽים׃ (טו) וַיְהִ֗י כִּֽי־הִקְשָׁ֣ה פַרְעֹה֮ לְשַׁלְּחֵ֒נוּ֒ וַיַּהֲרֹ֨ג ה' כׇּל־בְּכוֹר֙ בְּאֶ֣רֶץ מִצְרַ֔יִם מִבְּכֹ֥ר אָדָ֖ם וְעַד־בְּכ֣וֹר בְּהֵמָ֑ה עַל־כֵּן֩ אֲנִ֨י זֹבֵ֜חַ לַֽה' כׇּל־פֶּ֤טֶר רֶ֙חֶם֙ הַזְּכָרִ֔ים וְכׇל־בְּכ֥וֹר בָּנַ֖י אֶפְדֶּֽה׃

Exodus 13:14-15

(14) And when, in time to come, a child of yours asks you, saying, ‘What does this mean?’ you shall reply, ‘It was with a mighty hand that ה' brought us out from Egypt, the house of bondage. (15) When Pharaoh stubbornly refused to let us go, ה' slew every [male] first-born in the land of Egypt, the first-born of both human and beast. Therefore I sacrifice to ה' every first male issue of the womb, but redeem every male first-born among my children.’

The text adressed at the Chacham reflects the original form of the Seder - discussing the laws of the korban Pesach! Especially noteworthy is that the actual response suggested in the continuation of the pasuk of “מָ֣ה הָעֵדֹ֗ת וְהַֽחֻקִּים” - i.e. "עֲבָדִ֛ים הָיִ֥ינוּ"- is not mentioned at this place in the Haggadah.

The verse "בַּעֲבוּר זֶה עָשָׂה ה" is appearing twice as source text, first for the Rasha and finally for the She'eno Yode'a Lishol. Also "מָה (הָעֲבוֹדָה הַ)זּאֹת" is appearing twice.

מכילתא דרבי ישמעאל, מַסֶּכְתָּא דְפִסְחָא י״ח:כ״ד

נִמְצֵאתָ אוֹמֵר, אַרְבָּעָה בָנִים הֵם: אֶחָד חָכָם, אֶחָד טִפֵּשׁ, אֶחָד רָשָׁע, אֶחָד שֶׁאֵינוֹ יוֹדֵעַ לִשְׁאֹל. חָכָם מַה הוּא אוֹמֵר? (דברים ו,כ) "מָה הָעֵדֹת וְהַחֻקִּים וְהַמִּשְׁפָּטִים אֲשֶׁר צִוָּה ה' אֱלֹקֵינוּ" אוֹתָנוּ? אַף אַתָּה, פְּתַח לוֹ בְהִלְכוֹת הַפֶּסַח, אֱמֹר לוֹ: אֵין מַפְטִירִין אַחַר הַפֶּסַח אֶפִּיקוֹמוֹן. טִפֵּשׁ, "לֵאמֹר: מַה זֹּאת? וְאָמַרְתָּ אֵלָיו: בְּחֹזֶק יָד הוֹצִיאָנוּ ה' מִמִּצְרַיִם, מִבֵּית עֲבָדִים." רָשָׁע אוֹמֵר (שמות יב,כו) "מָה הָעֲבֹדָה הַזֹּאת לָכֶם?" וּלְפִי שֶׁהוֹצִיא אֶת עַצְמוֹ מִן הַכְּלָל, אַף אַתְּ, הוֹצִיאוֹ מִן הַכְּלָל, אֱמֹר לוֹ: (שמות יג,ח) "בַּעֲבוּר זֶה עָשָׂה ה' לִי", לִי, וְלֹא לָךְ! אִלּוּ הָיִיתָ שָׁם, לֹא הָיִיתָ נִגְאָל. וְשֶׁאֵינוֹ יוֹדֵעַ לִשְׁאֹל, אַתְּ פְּתַח לוֹ! שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר: (שמות יג,ח) "וְהִגַּדְתָּ לְבִנְךָ בַּיּוֹם הַהוּא לֵאמֹר: בַּעֲבוּר זֶה עָשָׂה ה' לִי בְּצֵאתִי מִמִּצְרָיִם."

Mekhilta DeRabbi Yishmael, Tractate Pischa 18:24

There are four sons: a wise son, a wicked son, a simple son, and one who does not know how to ask. What does the wise son say? "What are the testimonies and the statutes and the judgments that the L-rd our G-d commanded us?" — you, likewise, "open" to him in the halachoth of Pesach — "ein maftirin achar hapesach afikoman." What does the wicked son say? (Exodus 12:26) "What is this (Pesach) service to you?" "to you" and not to him. Because he disassociated himself from the congregation and denied the foundation (of the faith), you, likewise, blunt his teeth and tell him (Ibid. 13;8) "Because of this (the mitzvoth) the L-rd wrought for me when I went out of Egypt." For me and not for you. Had you been there, you would not have been redeemed. What does the simple son say? (Ibid. 14) "What is this?" And you shall tell him (Ibid.) "With might of hand did the L-rd take us out of Egypt from the house of bondage." And he who does not know how to ask, you open for him, as it is written (Ibid. 8) "And you shall tell your son on that day, etc."

Note that the Tipesh of the Mechilta, became Tam in the Hagada. So Tam in this context means naive rather than perfect, complete. Note that the Mechilta has ‘Otanu’ rather than ‘Etchem’ in its phrasing of the question of the Chacham—unlike the verse as it appears in the Torah—evidently to contrast it with the question of the Rasha.

תלמוד ירושלמי פסחים י׳:ד׳:ב׳

תני ר' חייה כנגד ארבעה בנים דיברה תורה בן חכם בן רשע בן טיפש בן שאינו יודע לשאול. בן חכם מהו אומר (דברים ו) מה העדות והחקים והמשפטים אשר צוה ה' אלקינו אותנו אף אתה אמור לו (שמות יג) בחזק יד הוציאנו ה' ממצרים מבית עבדים. בן רשע מהו אומר (שמות יב) מה העבודה הזאת לכם מה הטורח הזה שאתם מטריחין עלינו בכל שנה ושנה מכיון שהוציא את עצמו מן הכלל אף אתה אמור לו (שמות יב) בעבור זה עשה ה' לי לי עשה לאותו האיש לא עשה. אילו היה אותו האיש במצרים לא היה ראוי להגאל משם לעולם. טיפש מה אומר (שמות יב) מה זאת אף את למדו הלכות הפסח שאין מפטירין אחר הפסח אפיקומן שלא יהא עומד מחבורה זו ונכנס לחבורה אחרת. בן שאינו יודע לשאול את פתח לו תחילה א"ר יוסה מתניתא אמרה כן אם אין דעת בבן אביו מלמדו:

Jerusalem Talmud Pesachim 10:4:2

HALAKHAH: Rebbi Ḥiyya stated “The Torah spoke about Four Children, a wise child, a wicked child, a stupid child, and a child who does not know how to ask. What does the wise child say? What are the testimonials, the ordinances, and the laws, that the Eternal, our God, commanded us? Also you shall tell him, with a strong hand did the Eternal lead us out of Egypt, the house of slaves. What does the wicked son say? What does this service mean to you? What is this exertion which you impose on us every (moment) [year]? Since he excluded himself from the community, also you shall tell him, because of this did the Eternal do for me when I left Egypt. For me, He did it, for that man He did not do it. If that man had been in Egypt, he would not have been worthy ever to be redeemed. What does the stupid child say? What is this? Tell him the rules of Passover, that one may not follow the Pesaḥἐπὶ κῶμον. What means ἐπὶ κῶμον? That one not leave one company and join another company. With the child who does not know how to ask, you have to begin and initiate with him.” Rebbi Yose said, that is what the Mishnah says, “if the son does not know how to ask, his father instructs him.”

Note that the Yerushalmi swaps the answers to the Chacham and the Tipesh! Also note that the section of the "four children" does not appear in the Bavli

The midrash of the 4 children, should be compared against similar structures in Pirke Avot

משנה אבות ה׳:י׳

אַרְבַּע מִדּוֹת בָּאָדָם. הָאוֹמֵר שֶׁלִּי שֶׁלִּי וְשֶׁלְּךָ שֶׁלָּךְ, זוֹ מִדָּה בֵינוֹנִית. וְיֵשׁ אוֹמְרִים, זוֹ מִדַּת סְדוֹם. שֶׁלִּי שֶׁלְּךָ וְשֶׁלְּךָ שֶׁלִּי, עַם הָאָרֶץ. שֶׁלִּי שֶׁלְּךָ וְשֶׁלְּךָ שֶׁלָּךְ, חָסִיד. שֶׁלִּי שֶׁלִּי וְשֶׁלְּךָ שֶׁלִּי, רָשָׁע:

Pirkei Avot 5:10

There are four types of character in human beings: One that says: “mine is mine, and yours is yours”: this is a commonplace type; and some say this is a sodom-type of character. [One that says:] “mine is yours and yours is mine”: is an unlearned person (am haaretz); [One that says:] “mine is yours and yours is yours” is a pious person. [One that says:] “mine is mine, and yours is mine” is a wicked person.

Theodotos of Rome and roasted meat on Pesach

תוספתא ביצה (ליברמן) ב׳:ט״ו

אי זהו גדי מקולס, כולו צלי, ראשו כרעיו וקרבו, בישל ממנו כל שהו, שלק ממנו כל שהו, אין זה גדי מקולס… אמ' ר' יוסה, תודוס איש רומי הנהיג את בני רומי ליקח טלאים בלילי פסחים ועושין אותן מקולסין, אמרו לו אף הוא קרוב להאכיל קדשים בחוץ, מפני שקורין אותן פסחין.

Tosefta Beitzah (Lieberman) 2:15

What is a "helmet buck"? Whole roasted, with head and legs inside. If you have cooked even the smallest piece of it, or if you have boiled even the smallest piece of it, it is not “helmed”. A little goat with a helmet is prepared on the night of the last Passover holiday, a calf with a helmet on at night on the first Passover holiday, but not a helmeted cheek. R. Yose said: Theudas from Rome introduced the Romans to the custom of buying lambs and preparing them helmeted on the night of Passover. They said to him: He was also close of getting the public to eat holy sacrificial food outside of Jerusalem, because they were called Passover lambs.

פירוש קצר על ביצה ב׳:ט״ו:ד׳

מפני שקורין וכו'. כלומר, בני רומי היו קורין אותן פסחים, מה שאין כן בני הארץ, ולפיכך התיר רבן גמליאל במשנתנו.

Brief Commentary on Beitzah 2:15:4

...

משנת ארץ ישראל על משנה פסחים ד׳:ד׳:א׳-י״ב

לא מן הנמנע שתודוס איש רומי מימי הבית. בתקופה זו התבצע קרבן פסח רק בירושלים, וממילא נזפו חכמים במי שהנהיג את המעשה ברחבי העולם. בכתובת בית הכנסת בירושלים מסופר על תיאודוטוס בן וטינוס איש רומי שבנה בית כנסת בירושלים… שני האישים (תיאודוטוס איש רומי ותיאודוטוס בן וטינוס) הם בני רומי שהיו מוכרים בארץ, ושניהם מנהיגים המקורבים לעולמם של חכמים. על כן מותר לשער שתיאודוטוס איש רומי הוא תיאודוטוס מרומא שבנה את בית הכנסת בירושלים.

Mishnat Eretz Yisrael on Mishnah Pesachim 4:4:1-12

...

The Theodotos inscription is the earliest known inscription from a synagogue, from the days of Herod. It was found in December 1913 in the City of David. “Theodotos son of Vettenus, priest and head of the synagogue (archisynágōgos), son of a head of the synagogue, and grandson of a head of the synagogue, built the synagogue for the reading of the law and for the teaching of the commandments, as well as the guest room, the chambers, and the water fittings as an inn for those in need from abroad, the synagogue which his fathers founded with the elders and Simonides.”